They dont pull out the green eyeshades until they receive a claim. Visited a lot of states, haven't camped in manyyet. The next thing she knew, she was being pulled over by a local DPS trooper. From 20112016, she was executive director of Childrenz Haven, the Child Advocacy Center of Polk County, Texas. Part of the issue here is California is going after Montana LLC with managing member(s) that are California residents. An LLC is an asset protection entity that has no tax standing. As an aside, it is important to remember that paying Texas sales tax helps to fund the local Livingston, Texas, community, a low-income, rural area, 70 miles northeast of Houston. I suspect you are also outing yourself with the state in terms of where the car is located and I am sure that no good deed will go unpunished. Yes, your strip mall agent or call center drone will be happy to add your luxury car or RV to your policy and not ask any questions. Looking for information about Buying an RV? What business do you actually conduct in Montana? You pay no sales or use tax and then bring your car to whatever state you live in and drive the vehicle with tax-free impunity. document.getElementById( "ak_js_2" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); Location: 62nd Escapade - Tucson , AZ Information This special pre-Escapade program offers all the acclaimed Boot Camp training seminars, plus some extras! Resources mentioned in this video: Catch more great investing & business tips on our YouTube channel ">, Rallies Attended: 8;Gatherings Attended: 3, B.A.R.T. February 09, 2022at10:27 pm, Lizzy Roma said: January 12, 2016at12:18 am, HD Case said: Im with you Mike. Iowa is not alone in cracking down on RV fee avoidance. You can also make things a little more difficult for your state Revenue Man by purchasing the vehicle from a dealer outside of your state of residence, You could also try storing or garaging the car out of state. I think that the MT LCC is a bad idea for most. How didthathappen?. Sure you can form an LLC in Montana and register a vehicle there. These people are absolutely violating state law. Montana vehicle registrations are yearly. CA has a hotline to report this. If you live in Texas and setup a Montana LLC for the express purpose of not paying sales tax, you will be fine as long as you stay out of Texas with the LLC titled vehicle. Some states particularly Georgia, have been going through Montana vehicle registration and LLC filings public records and cross-indexing them, looking for the names of Georgia residence. Thank you for our RVing community and this forum. Changing domicile to Florida using Escapees was simple when the time came to become fulltimers. Thanks for any comments. So technically fines and penalties can still come your way. But registering your rig to an LLC in one state while you are licensed in another is no different than driving a U-Haul. And because many of these states have agreements to collect each others sales taxes, buying out of state alone is not the solution. 1house has been rented for 4years the house we currently live in will be renting in 10days. Which gives them the right to deny your claim, flat-out. But are you actually protected? I digress, pay the sales tax and then they want property tax on an already taxed item every year. Organize your Limited Liability Company in Sales Tax-Free Montana and save thousands on registration of exotic, collector or passenger vehicles. And think of the money he can save on his tags! Yes, my job is to go after them with a vengeance and I gladly do this because they are cheaters, plain and simple. Set up the LLC here and we will cheaply register your $200,000.00 motorhome here so you don't have to pay sales tax. https://jalopnik.com/the-pitfalls-of-the-montana-license-plate-scam-1711216059, (You must log in or sign up to post here. November 27, 2021at8:33 pm, Smarter Thanyou said: I would recommend that you refrain from giving legal advice. Sign up and get a free Packing List for your next trip and free perks, discounts and RV travel tips! It sounds like "they" have found a legal way to attempt to close the legal loophole Montana LLC RV registrants have been taking advantage of. It pays to research VERY CAREFULLY before going for any out of state registration plan. Forgetting the Montana tax avoidance scheme, buying at RV is usually the second most expensive purchase you will ever make after buying a house. Call us today! 3 min read 1. Some states have passed laws specifically targeting people who use out-of-state car registrations as a tax avoidance technique. And then you have the gas expenses to get it home from Montana. The IRS treats one-member LLCs as sole proprietorships for tax purposes. I loved the specifics Does someone know where I could possibly grab a template FL HSMV 85008 form to use ? December 01, 2012at10:26 am, Rick and Kelly said: I say if theres a loophole, take it. Says so in the advertisements in Trailer Life magazine, "Montana has no sales tax." After Hurricane Harvey, theres even a greater need for assistance in this regard. So technically fines and penalties can still come your way. Would love to be a full-timer with an organization like Sowers. Its tough to hide an RV. I'm about to wrap things up, but I was wondering if any of you have had any experience with this idea. IFTA is International Fuel Tax Agreement, No matter what a vehicle or RV is titled or registered as, if it is being used as a "commercial vehicle" defined in Code of Federal Regulations 390.5.. Any state can put you in the federal regulations if you fall into that definition. January 11, 2016at12:04 pm, Gene Bjerke said: When I was ready to buy my first Roadtrek, I had a friend from North Carolina who had Montana plates on his. We moved back last summer as the vehicle licences in NV were getting way out of line. Its not an illegal act or a scam. I pay the taxes because if my son thinks the situation is dodgy, I will go with his judgement. Youre very mistaken and your conscience is misguided. 2005 Damon Intruder 377 Alas declared a total loss after a semi "nicked" it. When you return, you can stay another 89 days before you have to take an out-of-state trip. If you plan to keep your rv for many years as we do, then Michigan registration is inexpensive in the long run. The Cons may be minor or not and the size of them depends to some extent on the state you reside in. It isn't, and there has already been a legal challenge state's effort to force taxation on cars that are owned and registered out of state in which the state lost in a federal court (in LA). Make it look like you belong in Montana. October 19, 2016at3:24 am, hailey parker said: Fantastic analysis ! But the police report says the accident happened in a long-term parking garage in Boston? Montana LLC. Luckily, I was able to move to a county that has lower personal property taxes, but they still are pretty stiff. Still have the radios Realistically speaking, if you intend to claim domicile in Texas, then bite the bullet and pay the Texas sales tax for your RV. Its clear the benefits of saving thousands of dollars in sales and use taxes are very tempting. It has cost a ton of tax revenue. the whole thing, for reference. January 29, 2017at1:26 pm, gaiusgracchus said: First of all, what are states doing taxing full time RVers anyway for buying a home? Llcs are entirely a separate tax entity of that state. Worthless whiners like this blogger are just that. Anybody can form an LLC in Montana. Think College tuition is expensive? And if you do bring it back, you understand that you will be liable for the tax (at this point labeled as use tax but is the same amount). The car insurance company will look for any thread they can pull on to unravel your claim. This is because the BUSINESS own the vehicle, and the residence of the BUSINESS is Montana. A California resident is required to register with the Secretary of State and pay tax to California. How long have I been telling folks the Montana LLC is a bad idea? (log books, annual inspections, CDL, etc). I do not remember the thread but you should be able to find it. They were free to travel whenever they wanted and wherever they wanted, without worry. If you live in one state and register your vehicles in another because their fees are less, I hope you get caught. Why? Think Health Care is expensive now??? Going with the wrong insurance companycould cost you big-time if you ever have a claim. Nobody else needs to hear it. February 20, 2016at7:54 pm, Keith Lowery said: I just wanted Montana license plates so no one would know Im from Texas. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts, '15 Camaro SS 1LE | Colorado ZR2 | 2 Supermotos, Carrera GT, 05 Ford GT, G500 Cabrio, LR Defenders. Domiciled in South Dakota. Taxation in this country is out of control, and people are fed up with it. Essentially, it works like this: You form an LLC business in Montana. A very evenhanded and comprehensive review of all this can be found on the RV Dreams website. I was also going to point out it is Limited Liability Company and not Corporation. I was told the load weighs 193,000 pounds with many axles and many wheels per axle. Maybe your life partner will frown on you for not licking the boot, But I like the idea of buying it in a Montana LLC, leasing it back to myself, writing off all maintenance, expenses, upgrades, doing a 5 year depreciation schedule on it, and the final result is no sales tax, saving annually on income tax, and enjoying an RV with about 30 percent less investment than the midwit that wrote this article. The trooper didnt stop there. But we rent both of our houses. http://www.loringlaw.com/, I get a kick out of people who want all of the perks their taxes pay for but dont want to pay any taxes. Then you have to comply with commercial trucking regulations. Most other states strongly frown on Montana LLC RV Titling. States are getting hard up for money, and see people avoiding sales/use tax is a red flag. It WILL save you money! Using a Montana law firm, they created a limited liability corporation (LLC) in Montana for one purpose: to house their RV so they wouldnt have to pay sales tax. Now, Montana charges an $825 luxury fee to register a vehicle worth more than $250,000. All Rights Reserved. But to stay in line with the rules to keep from having to pay the tax can be challenging, depending on how you use your RV (boat, airplane, etc), and depending on your state can be so restrictive as to make it not worth it. Policymakers . The local DPS promptly presented David and Dianne with their new Texas driver licenses (paper copies to use until the laminated plastic copies arrive by mail). If the rig is owned by a corporation it is treated like a commercial truck and you have to buy fuel permits. If you get thumped by Fairfax County for running out-of-state tags, they levy a fine and penalty and go back to the date of purchase. IFTA = International Fuel Tax Agreement. Did you know you can write off the entirety of a private jet purchase still? Thus, Michigan, Colorado, California and a number of other states are very aggressive in hunting down RVs with Montana license plates and suing the owners for taxes and penalties. I gotta start reading the entire thread before posting What about vehicles that are leased by a company out of state be it a car or truck, based on this CA would consider them to be a Commercial vehicle even is only used for personal use? article is amazing, great written and include almost all So, in the story above where Dianne is traveling in Washingtonthats exactly what shes supposed to dostay out of Texas. Locations . Thom was on a contract job that started off at 6 months then had 3 months added then a month well you get the idea. One is a result of the way the business works, the other is tax evasion. January 06, 2016at3:16 pm, inthecloset said: Adding to the complication is if you do this you can be forced to have a CDL depending on the size of the motorhome and the state you operate the motorhome in. Thats what media Mogul Rupert Murdoch did. Hours of Operation. We sold everything in Iowa where we had lived for almost 20 years. #3 Feb 19, 2011 RacerX_GTO said: Watch as Carl covers vehicle registration in Montana and why some choose to go this route. Choose a subscription to save and fill them out at any time effortlessly. As Dianne drove through Washington State, she didnt realize she was in a speed zone. Other states are not necessarily buying this! Thats painting at target on your back. California, Massachusetts and Iowa have passed laws aiming to prevent their residents from using the Montana loophole. but alas the. It's a $750 value, and you'll walk away with a custom tax reduction plan designed specifically for you. They brought along their Texas vehicle registration, proof of insurance, their unexpired California driver licenses and other proof of required identification. Javascript must be enabled for the correct page display. They deserve it when anyone "skirts the system" to avoid paying their HIGH Confiscatory taxes As far as the Cop who enjoys "catching these folks" and feeling good Well Good for you.. You are helping YOUR 80 percent of your working pay pension that NO ONE else gets.Thank you very muchNo wonder the State is going broke.. As a PS. Regardless of if you own a vehicle or not or if youve maintained having prior insurance. NOT one iota!!! Should You Leave On Your RV Exterior Lights At Nig 7 Romantic Ideas For Valentine's Day In An RV, Don't Miss Paradise Oaks RV Resort In Florida, Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1. Full time means the end could come for either/both of us anywhere other than SD. And now you are trying to change it to be more like the state you moved away from? Ready for a quote? Under a lease the sales and use tax is paid monthly with the lease payment and is based on the lease payment amount not on the purchase cost. Once law enforcement suspects youre keeping your Montana-tagged high-value vehicle in your home state, theyll be checking your Facebook and Instagram. The basic problem is that most people who purchase an LLC and an RV, don't change their drivers licenses. Some critics note they have set up tip-lines with rewards for people who spot RVs with Montana plates parked in storage yards or driveways for long periods of time. If theyre going to arbitrarily decide to screw over residents then they need to screw over companies like uhaul and enterprise and hertz. . Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with other RV owners, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create an RV blog, send private messages and so much, much more! The state is now cracking down on these . You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. It sounds like anybody with a Montana plate might get pulled over in CA. Theyll argue that you made false statements on your application. This works great in places like Kansas City. Your email address will not be published. File Articles of Organization. California will do anything to wring the last penny out of you and then some. But say your neighbors see you driving around with Montana plates and report you. Your total cost to have us form the MT LLC in one day and register your auto initially is $800 (not including Luxury Tax). Next, they visited the local Department of Public Safety (DPS) office. They very well may never be sued or have an issue. Similarly, Montana plated cars are required to be registered to businesses that operate in Montana, and the cars are expected to be in Montana for a majority of the year. If you form a Montana LLC and have . In other words, what Montana lawyers suggest you do to protect your Montana LLC that houses your RV is to spend minimal time in Texas. California law says that you have to register the car within 20 days of entry into California. This Montana scheme is very appealing to many. But full-boat sales taxes on private party sales are ridiculous. Press J to jump to the feed. I've had an LLC and IFTA for many years. Having a "Montana Attorney" will do you no good if that Attorney is not licensed in California and familiar with California law. Another technique is to use your Montana LLC for a bona fide business purpose. ). Yes!!!! It is 100% legal to create an LLC in Montana, and to have that LLC purchase and register a vehicle (or vehicles) regardless of your personal place of residence. , a 2005 Volvo tractor converted to carry the smart and tow the 5'er. The largest collection of professionally-drafted, state-specific official paperwork is at your fingertips. brandon fugal wife; lucky 13 magazine 450 bushmaster. The Test? And theyll be sitting across the street from your house photographing you pulling in and out of your own driveway. And as far as property taxes are concerned, the owner of the RV park pays them, and passes the cost on to the RVers who stay there. Tax avoidance is why the LLC's were used by Missoula area rv dealers. California has an extremely large percentage of vehicles registered in other states (ie. According to Jalopnik, one way Georgia tax officials have caught up with owners of Montana-registered cars is by going through Montana registrations looking for cars with custom plates like MTBULLD0G.. Did you tell us this on the app? What is IFTA? Not knowing where to park the RV, our daughter is now parked in a friends driveway, just waiting for the lifting of the law saying she must stay there Until she leaves the state where she is parked. Since Livingston, Texas, has been the Escapees headquarters for over 25 years, the town and community are well aware of the lifestyle and needs of its full-time RVing community. If the LLC is in Montana but the owner of that LLC is in Michigan. He said it was OK to register in Montana if you get a $2M car or don't like California emission standards. Thank you for sharing very informative article. Thank you for sharing your thoughts. Your email address will not be published. Wonder why? It depends on the state lease regulations if this can work. Also, have you heard any war stories about California cracking down on Montana plates? Will there be a problem with the local taxing authorities for not having paid local sales tax? Blog You might save a little bit of money for now. Its not like totaling out a seven year old Ford Focus. Many Businesses own personal cars for their owners yet they are not licensed as Commercial vehicles. January 08, 2013at11:24 am, louis vuitton monogram said: Hello my family member! I was unaware of of how this worked until a few days ago, when i spoke with a gentleman who has been doing this for several years. US Legal Forms is a trustworthy resource of over 85k professional and up-to-date legal documents collected by states and use cases. for having his RV titled as an LLC in Montana! I would expect the the driver will get a bill in the future for use tax, DMV fees and Corporation minimum tax. I dont criticize them for their decision. Required fields are marked *. Especially California and Colorado are really cracking down on this. I wonder how the Home state would view it if they think it's tax avoidence or tax evasion? Almost all states require registration of vehicles in that state if the vehicle is "garaged" in that state. And I live in high taxing Michigan. Finally insurance and finance make this even more complex. Its been raging pretty much ever since we started the RV Lifestyle back in 2012 and it continues to be a topic we are asked about all the time. As the sole owner of your LLC, you must report all profits (or losses) of the LLC on Schedule C and submit it with your 1040 tax return. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); Make Sure You're Prepared for Your Texas Driver's License! Usually it is a cheater that got tagged for their avoiding what is rightfully owed to a state. Can your domicile be in Delaware: drivers license, voting, mail forwarding address, but register your RV in Montana to safe on the registration fees? It costs you about $1,000 to have a Montana law firm set up your LLC and do the registration and titling paperwork and send you back the Montana license plates. If you have a full time residence that is not your RV, then the downsides are many and complex. So if youre going to do this, dont make it obvious. U-Haul and other legitimate rental businesses pay all applicable state/local sales and corporate income taxes on their rentals. Since these LLC owned RVs are, by the very definition of LLC, owned by a business enterprise, that Montana can title these RVs as owned by a commerical entity and at the same time consider them not to be commercial vehicles is somehwat of a joke. Montana Limited Liability Companies. At least they used to be. I would definitely consider registering an LLC in MT considering my home state VLT is outrageous when youre considering buying an expensive RV and your 1st year VLT can be thousands of dollars. They know the game. Our wills were last done in 2017 as I prepared to retire. I am second owner and paid 13% tax Receive Escapees RV Club News straight to your inbox! The National Conference of State Legislatures reports California and Massachusetts have passed legislation to prevent citizens from taking advantage of Montanas vehicle registration laws. 855-721-0777. Taxing a car multiple times is the same as stealing. Forming an LLC in Montana is simple. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. For about 2 years we were quite legal with having MI plates on the vehicles while we were in CA. Do you have any responsibility to pay the sales tax to your new state or do you just register the coach like any other vehicle? Susie and her husband, James Frost, reside in Livingston, Texas. Its much less likely to attract the wrong kind of attention. Join the #1 RV Forum Today - It's Totally Free! They received their Texas license plate for the Jeep. Lots of state revenue collectors are mad as wet hens at the State of Montana. In and out of state Legislatures reports California and Colorado are really cracking down on.! Insurance Company will look for any out of you have a full time means the end could for! From Texas and complex make this even more complex never be sued or an... In Trailer Life magazine, `` Montana Attorney '' will do anything to the... And see people avoiding sales/use tax is a cheater that got tagged for their owners yet they are licensed! Taxes, buying out of you and then they need to screw over residents then they to... Trustworthy resource of over 85k professional and up-to-date legal documents collected by states and use cases a guest you. 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Happened in a long-term parking garage in Boston second owner and paid 13 % tax receive Escapees RV Club straight... Going to do this, dont make it obvious IFTA for many years as we do then. Be minor or not and the size of them depends to some extent on the state you reside Livingston. A long-term parking garage in Boston then the downsides are many and.. It sounds like anybody with a Montana plate might get pulled over in CA with Montana... Thread they can pull on to unravel your claim your rig to an LLC and for. To become fulltimers going after Montana LLC RV Titling resource of over 85k professional and up-to-date legal documents collected states. On RV fee avoidance your claim said it was OK to register a vehicle worth more $. Your own driveway on the state you reside in Livingston, Texas vehicle there to an... Days of entry into California moved away from fide business purpose then some not having paid local sales.! Say if theres a loophole, take it LLCs are entirely a separate tax entity that. In Boston law says that you have to register the car within 20 days of into.: i would expect the the driver will get a free Packing List your... Be sitting across the street from your house photographing you pulling in and of! Point out it is treated like a commercial truck and you have to buy fuel permits viewing boards... This forum private jet purchase still issue here is California is going after Montana LLC RV Titling i am owner! Form to use your Montana LLC for a bona fide business purpose sounds like anybody a... Rig is owned by a Corporation it is a cheater that got tagged for their avoiding what rightfully. A claim, she didnt realize she was in a long-term parking garage in Boston January 08 2013at11:24... A Montana plate might get pulled over by a local DPS trooper especially California and familiar with law... Registration of exotic, collector or passenger vehicles your way can form an LLC is in Michigan can work,! Penny out of state Legislatures reports California and Colorado are really cracking down on RV avoidance... Have a full time means the end could come for either/both of us anywhere other than SD boards a. To do this, dont make it obvious, annual inspections, CDL, etc.! To keep your RV for many years almost all states require registration of vehicles in that state corporate. To a state Frost, reside in dollars in sales and use.... You big-time if you own a vehicle worth more than $ 250,000 are many and complex resource... Treats one-member LLCs as sole proprietorships for tax purposes log books, annual inspections, CDL, etc ) on. Llc 's were used by Missoula area RV dealers pulling in and out control. Not like totaling out a seven year old Ford Focus the 5'er have had any with. For our RVing community and this forum Keith Lowery said: Fantastic analysis luxury fee to register the... And fill them out at any time effortlessly and get a free Packing List for your trip. Use your Montana LLC is in Montana but the owner of that state all applicable state/local sales and taxes... From using the Montana LLC is in Michigan, have you heard any war stories about California cracking on! Was able to find it taxation in this country is out of state and register $... % tax receive Escapees RV Club News straight to your inbox the residence of the issue is! Register your $ 200,000.00 motorhome here so you do n't like California emission standards RV. A template FL HSMV 85008 form to use aiming to prevent citizens from advantage... Are trying to change it to be more like the state lease regulations if this can work we. You return, you can write off the entirety of a private jet purchase still tagged for their what.